this post was submitted on 11 Aug 2023
223 points (93.7% liked)
World News
31540 readers
933 users here now
News from around the world!
Rules:
-
Please only post links to actual news sources, no tabloid sites, etc
-
No NSFW content
-
No hate speech, bigotry, propaganda, etc
founded 4 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
The annexations in Ukraine are illegal, but Russia annexing 5 oblasts and Ukraine being locked into a status as a neutral buffer state is not exactly a Hitlerian take-over of Europe.
Its not ilegal in russia. Legality is not a real property of things its the opinion of the guy with the biggest army in the area. Thinking otherwise is
No, annexation is illegal under the UN charter, of which Russia is a signatory, and wars of aggression are criminal in and of themselves. I'll condemn the illegal annexations performed by Israel and other states, and Russia's annexations fall under the same boat.
To be even more clear, I do think that Russia would have won fair referendums in Donetsk, Luhansk and certainly Crimea. I doubt that would have been the case for the other two oblasts. Still, all of those annexations were illegal. Just because the neo-cons have flouted the UN charter in favor of the ad hoc "rules-based order" doesn't mean others should.
What's your point, that Soros is a hypocrite? That was always obvious. Is he more of a zionist than the average American lib though?
It's always funny seeing people post that image without the context that Palestine declared war on Israel alongside all its neighbours and attempted to push the Israeli population into the sea.
And Ukraine kept shelling civilians in Donetsk despite signing Minsk 2.
And that's not even taking into account that Israel has continued to annex new land despite it not being a war.
The correct response to a settler colonial ethnostate being founded in your region by Britain is to try to destroy it.
Which excuses attempted genocide?
i wouldnt call it an attempt, Israel is sure as hell succeeding in killing and displacing a lot of Palestinian civilians and also running the world's largest open air prison
Ending the existence of an illegitimate country built on stolen land has nothing to do with genocide. You're doing the fascist ethnostate thing where you act like a state and its people are the same thing. States come and go, people remain, the ending of a state has nothing to do with harming people.
The Palestinians have the stated goal of murdering the Israeli people as well as ending the Israeli state
Ending the Israeli state is not ending the people. Fuck off. 21% of the "Israeli people" are arab you fucking racist shit, but you're not including them when you say "Israeli" are you? No.
I absolutely will not apologise for calling you racist. Whether you know this fact and are saying this shit knowingly or whether you're just utterly oblivious to what the conditions are in Israel doesn't matter. Oblivious racism is still racism.
If the Israeli state is destroyed, what happens to the Israeli people?
What the fuck do you think happens when a country ends? The people magically disappear? Jesus fucking christ.
When we communists successfully end america do you also think we're aiming to perform unlimited genocide on the population? Are you out of your mind? Am I as a UK resident communist trying to murder the population of the UK by ending the British state?
Fuck me liberals are completely politically illiterate. Please read some god damn books instead of white billionaire-owned media and reddit comment sections.
Do you really genuinely believe that the current Palestinian leadership would not perpetrate a genocide against the Israel people if they had the power and opportunity to do so?
The destruction of the state of Israel to be replaced by a fair socialist democratic order would obviously be a positive outcome, but there is no entity in Israeli, Palestine or the entire region with even the remotest hope of accomplishing that.
The Israeli government is largely a house of neoliberals and fascists, and the Palestinian governments are various flavours of theocracies and ethnocracies, some with a socialist history but they are certainly not socialist now.
How dare you
Well Israel is an ethnostate so it doesn't deserve to exist.
Palestine is and was an ethnocracy. They're hardly any better.
Israel literally funded the far right extremist organizations because they'd rather fight them than socialist resistance. It's Israel's fault they're like that.
And I suppose they managed this even before Israel came into existence? They have always been like this. The original leaders of the Palestinian government in the Arab-Israeli war were largely fascist anti-communist agitators.
It might very generously be Israel's fault that they're still like this, but that does not change the reality of the situation.
That is what I'm saying and that is what matters.
The reality is that Israel is a settler colonial ethnostate genociding Palestinians and it shouldn't exist.
Sure, it shouldn't have been created, but it's here now, and the majority of people living in it were born there. We can't make it go away by wishful thinking.
Do you think dissolving Israel would require relocating everyone? Thats like saying the only way to fight white supremacy in the US is to kill or relocate all the white people.
History has proven time and again that given the opportunity, the nation's bordering Israel in every direction (save possibly Lebanon) will try to either annex Israel or restore the entirety of it to an Arab nationalist muslim government.
Should such an event come to pass, the displacement of the entire population would be a best case scenario. The Jewish population of Syria and Jordan are both zero, and Egypt's is less than 20, down from several hundred thousand between the three in 1948.
There is no way to interpret the Hama's charter other than incitement to genocide.
The major factors preventing another Arab-Israeli war are tensions with Iran, Billions of dollars in US military aid, and the nuclear weapons likely owned by the Israeli state.
Dissolve the Israeli state, and unless you replace with something similar, and those factors will no longer stand. Compromise the territorial integry of the new state to any serious degree, including ceding the west bank to a Palestinian state, and Israel becomes militarily indefensible.
"Israel has to do genocide or the people Israel funded might to genocide"
You know Israel could just try to be a pluralistic society that doesn't do genocide or apartheid right? But then it wouldn't really be Israel would it?
How exactly could Israel try to be a pluralistic society? Neither side will accept a one state solution.
Well, Israel could start funding socialist opposition who wouldn't do sectarian violence to them if apartheid ended. It worked with Hamas, it should work the other way around.
And other things that won't happen because again, Israel is a settler colonialist ethnostate bent on exterminating Palestinians.
No amount of money is going to change attitudes that severely without some sort of forced indoctrination. It didn't work with Hamas, their attitude was there from the start, and years of Israeli and Iranian funding has only helped them remain one of the major Palestinian political organisations.
And please, Israel is an apartheid state sure, no arguments here, but the Palestinian population is one of the fasted growing in the world. They are entirely at the mercy of the Israeli state, and if the Israeli goal were to exterminate them as you say, they would have had some results in the past seventy years.
"The indigenous americans shouldn't have fought back against the settlers if they didn't want to get exterminated."
"international law" comes with what coercive enforcement again?
If russian law considers they are part of russia and the russian army is siting there russian law applies there. Thats how it works. If another army is sitting there then legality is whatever those other guys say.
Pretending otherwise is denying realty.
I don't know a lot about the region, but I think this gives Russia access to some large oil deposits and excellent agricultural land. It will also give them more strength in the region. I think it's worth extending the war to try and limit those gains. It's a good situation for the US.
Only because they lack the ability. Civilian massacres like in Bucha are happening and have been happening throughout the war.